Graham Pushes Lieberman; Emerges As Big Backer

...for an automatic Pro-choice administration is stupid!

People get to decide whether or not they want to terminate the fetus after the pregnancy has been completed.

Boo-Yeah!

It is what it is.

Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!

I don't think it's an issue because I don't think it will happen. I'm solidly in the McCain camp now...the VP pick is the only thing that would change that equation...Lieberman would do that without question.

I've said this before and I'll say it again...As things now stand...McCain is good enough...if the choice becomes McCain/Lieberman...my calculator starts working on whether it might be better to eat 4 years of Obama to get a Reagan in 4. Allowing the RMSP types to win with such a strategy would prove we're nothing more than whores who would sell out every position we believe in for victory and encourage them to shove even more crap down our throats in 2012 and 2016.

You may not like it...but I'm anything but stupid and the fact that you insist on calling me and people of conscience like me stupid says far more about you than it does me ...and I know for a fact that there are hundreds of thousands like me hanging on by their fingernails right now who would be knocked off the wagon by such a pick.

Finally...no body owns me...and nobody has a right or the ability to order me to vote for anyone...my vote has to be earned...McCain did that effective Saturday at Saddleback...but I've got to tell you...this attitude coming from you, and Chris Jones at Red State and from other right wing sites I frequent that the Party can do whatever it Damn well pleases and we've just got to take it is crap and is really getting tiresome...

Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!

Were I into calling people stupid I'd say it is stupid to start this talk of nominating a Democrat , or a pro choicer to be VP just days after McCain finally scored a knockout and got his base fired up ands enthusiastic about him..and it's just plain idiotic to go out and attack Pro-Lifers hammer and tong just days after such an event...

But I don't call people stupid for following their consciences

Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!

First: I didn't call you stupid -- reading comprehension is your friend, use it!

Second: No one, including me, is telling anyone how to vote. And if you don't see merit in exploring all options on a site I designed to be a place where conservatives can debate such matters instead of just echoing in unison what one faction of the party thinks... Then I can't do anything for you.

Taking my comment as a personal attack or insult is ridiculous and leads one to believe you may be wound a little to tight. So please take some advice and relax a bit :)

started the site if you weren't ready to be challenged from time to time so I fail to see why you brought it up..

I realize you didn't call me stupid directly...though I was reacting to your post where you said something about how stupid it was to elect someone who was rabidly pro abortion by throwing a pro life presidential nominee under the bus because he nominated someone that was pro-choice...I understand the arguement...but if I reject the argument because I'm considering other factors...that doesn't make me stupid...

Finally...It's nothing personal...I am indeed wound pretty tight on this issue because I've been trying to write a blog since Monday about the cathartic moment I had Saturday that put me solidly in the vote McCain camp but I've gotten dragged into arguing on three different posts that have taken the same tack as yours which says mainly "do what you want John and screw those pro lifers!"

I'll be posting something on the whole thing shortly.

Aside from that...it's cool

:>)

Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!

There was nothing to challenge you expressed an opinion about a scenario (note that when read the scenario posted was not my express opinion or a position I was championing) I posted and I responded in kind. I've made my bones debating in the Blogesphere and will put my battle scars up against yours, anytime.... anywhere!

And this quote:

Is exactly why you need to slow down and comprehend what you read! That's twice your got it completely wrong!

I'm going to stop here and chalk this up to your emotions getting the better of you because I hope you're more intellectually honest than you've been on this thread.

Solely at you.

Yes emotions are playing a role because I've finally gotten comfortable with the thought of a President McCain and the Shut up and get in line crowd, (not you) started the arguement you discussed in this thread. It's like they don't want the base enthusiastic about McCain...like they want to keep us stirred up against him.

Again...there's nothing personal in what I wrote....and I don't see anything I said that is intellectually dishonest so maybe a look in the mirror is in order here? I don't know. I took your comment about stupid personally...and I'll take your word it's not directed at me...but you have to understand...that if McCain nominates Lieberman...and I leave my ballot blank...I have my reason...and if it elects Obama...my reasons are mine. you can characterize them as stupid...but they are what they are.

Again...nothing personal...and you can read my post from last night and see why my emotions got so out of whack and where you stand with me in the first paragraph...so...peace bro...hopefully 2012 will be a little easier on all of us!

:>)
Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!

My digs at you concerning your designing the site were simply directed at the fact that you brought it up...I said what I said simply to state that I don't see what you're designing and hosting this site has to do with the discussion at hand. I'm glad for this site and I'm glad you put it up there...but pulling that in from out of the blue as if it should shield you from criticism just struck me wrong. It's your site...and by all means you can set up the rules that way if you want...but I don't think you would do that...so why bring it up in a heated discussion?

Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!

...context and comprehension is key here I said:

in response to this:

Your insinuation that I'm somehow avoiding criticism is simply ridiculous...

You didn't criticize anything here you've only offered a rant and opinion on a scenario put forth. And an opinion I might add that is logic impaired as it pertains to a group or faction within the party - in my opinion

it is totally against my nature.

I believe we are all on the same side here.

...the point is moot anyway you look at it with McCain at the top of the ticket it makes little difference who the VP is... other than a feel good moral victory for one faction or the other.

The VP in a McCain administration will have as much input as the janitor.

Not voting for McCain, for any reason, is a vote for Obama and I just don't see anyone who cares about this country and is engaged politically doing that in any significant numbers. Could I be wrong? Sure but if they do we know who to blame!

Protest votes don't work!

Not voting for McCain, for any reason, is a vote for Obama and I just don't see anyone who cares about this country and is engaged politically doing that in any significant numbers.

We're talking about a (nominally) Republican nominee for President of the United States naming a (hard-core) liberal Democrat (Al Gore's former running mate, you'll of course recall) to be his Veep - putting said hardcore liberal the proverbial heartbeat away from the Presidency. That's a Rubicon that simply cannot be mentioned by anyone serious and certainly not actually seriously contemplated by the nominee himself.

Let me put it to you this way - the By-laws of my Republican Town Committee states, in summary, Thou Shalt Not Endorse Democrats. In fact, mentioning in public that one endorses a Democrat for any office makes said offender liable for expulsion from the Town Committee. So I ask you - why should John Freaking Sidney McMaverick be held to a lower standard in this regard than me?

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!

This remains true! I don't see that what you said disputes the fact that if some group stays home because of a pro-choice VP they essentially forfeit their vote to Obama!

As to By-laws and standards -- He shouldn't be! And this is really semantics but Joe is an (I) now, by law, not by heart or ideology (a case can be made that some R's hold the same beliefs but are still R's by law) But that's not the argument. The argument is "this is John McCain" and if he goes with his gut an nominates his friend Lieberman or a pro-choice (R) there is a path to victory and the republican base either votes for him to stop Obama or they don't. Either way those who choose to sit out because of a pro-choice VP pick lose. the difference is with a McCain victory they only lose a moral victory with an Obama win they lose everything - I don't understand why one would sacrifice a pro-life administration for an administration so heavily pro-choice with a liberal congress that would set their cause back decades. Principles are one thing but that seems extremely counter-intuitive.

Look I have no deep feelings here... like I said in the OP McCain ruined this cycle for me but I think he should explore all options for winning!

I'm afraid some Republicans are reading entirely too much into recent polls... these polls don't count yet!

Btw - you're analysis is still spot on... "We are so totally fricking screwed"

... and I don't pretend to speak for anyone else here - there is a huge freaking difference between nominating a (nominal or better) pro-choice Republican and Joe Lieberman. He's a Democrat - in everything but actual party affiliation and only then because a slim majority of Democrats in (BLUE) Connecticut decided a guy with a lifetime ACU rating in the single digits wasn't liberal enough for them. The notion that the GOP will nominate such a person for the number-two on a national ticket is simply nauseating and leads me to question why I continue to affiliate, in registration at least, with such an organization.

Not to open old scars, and I'm probably preaching to the choir here, but crap like this is precisely why people like me were so vocal and aggressive in our opposition to Maverick. And the viciousness with which we were put down as "over the top" and "party wreckers" is why I don't post at places like RS anymore.

Well - here's the Chickens... comin' home... to roost.

It's simply disheartening to think that, under the best case, the next 4 (or, shudder, 8) years are going to be all the joy and fun of a prison root canal.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

... it drives me to absolute flipping distraction that many of the same people who threw poo on Mitt Romney (my guy in the primaries) because he wasn't sufficiently straight-down-the-line "right" on a modest number of issues are now inferring that I have to shut-up and get in line if John Maverick McMavericky puts Joe Freaking Lieberman on the ticket.

And here I thought cognitive dissonance was reserved for Left Blogosphere, only.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

1. Private business executive experience. McCain has been a "government employee" his entire adult life. Romney balances McCain here very well.
2. Proven fund-raising abilities. McCain has been lacking here.
3. Hard-working, motivated, excited, political campaign structure. I saw this first-hand in Colorado during the primaries.
4. Proven ability to work with hostile congress. Romney complements McCain here. He won't scare off independents.
5. The ability to turn toss-up/lean Dem states to lean Rep. This includes Colorado, Montana, Nevada, New Mexico, Wisconsin, Minnesota & Michigan (and even a slight possibility of Massachusetts.

The only negative on Romney is his supposed "flip-flops" (he flipped, but didn't flop, and he flipped the right way). Some socons will wig out initially, but less so than they would if McCain chose Lieberman.

I would've made this a blog, but I have a senior project paper due at midnight. Maybe someone else can run with it. "The Case for Vice President Mitt Romney".

"After two years in Washington, I often long for the realism and sincerity of Hollywood." -Fred Dalton Thompson

We have gone from choosing a "moderate" Republican for our nominee for President (someone MUST have chosen him -- he's the nominee) to looking at a mainstream liberal Democrat as the VP choice.

WTF?

We don't even NEED Lucy pulling the ball out from in front of Charlie Brown, cause the goal posts are BEHIND him!

...of a primary cycle began that we were in for it! I remember Rove saying, at the time, something to the effect that we're going to have to live with the nominee we get from a front-loaded primary. He was right!

Some now say that McCain was the best choice to run against Obama that's arguable but alas we'll never know and that's the crappy part.

is the entire front-loaded primary system was designed as a Coronation of Hillary Clinton!

HAH!

That's what happens when you compromise...See Chamberlain vs Hitler over the Sudetenland, then Austria, then Czechoslovakia then finally Poland. Every compromise leads to a demand for another. So that part is predictable...What has me seething is the fact that people who I know are seriously intellectually Conservative to their core insist on attacking me as "Stupid," "Childish," "Throwing Tantrums", "Selfish," etc for objecting to a FXXXING DEMOCRAT as VP of my Party and stating a simple fact...a McCain Lieberman ticket is a direct gift from McCain to Obama of this entire election...and I'm damn sick and tired of hearing how it will be my fault for saying hell no when it would be the Mavericks decision that threw the election!!!

To top it off...McCain is not crazy...and it's never going to happen so I don't know why the RMSP types are pushing this argument! It plays perfectly into the Nutroots and KOSacks hands and couldn't have worked better for them if they had planned it themselves. Saturday McCain scored a knockout and took a jump in the polls showing a 5% lead over Obama Monday. Yeah it's one poll...but going from 5 points down to 5% up is a huge jump...then this talk starts on Monday...Pro-Life voters start burning up the lines to the RNC and the McCain Campaign to object...and here we are on Friday...The polls now show McCain back to even with Barry and we're tearing at each other's throats...AND I'm going nose to nose with someone I consider a friend over something that will never happen!

WHAT IN THE HELL HAS HAPPENED TO THIS PARTY???!!!

Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!

I've been beaten about the head endlessly by people who should know better for saying exactly that...so...the shut up and get in line crowd appears to be back!

Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!

Take a break Ace

"40 million American households that read TMR are generally happier
than those people in households that don't read TMR."

Impeach the Traitorous 5!!!